S1E6.1: Lauren Glazin | Blond Ambition Part 1
[Justin]
Welcome to the next episode of the Creating Belonging Podcast. Today, my guest is Lauren Glazin. And I want Lauren just to introduce herself.
So, Lauren, tell us about you.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yes. Hi, Justin. And hi, everyone.
So, I'm Lauren. And what should I tell everyone about myself? I'm Lauren.
I am a British person living in New York. And I'm Jewish. And I'm gay.
And I'm fun. And I'm blonde, by the way. Important identity that gets overlooked, I think.
[Justin]
Wait. Hold on. Hold on.
Pause. Are you a real blonde?
[Lauren Glazin]
That does, you know, these questions I'll answer at a later date. That doesn't matter. That doesn't matter for the content of this podcast.
Okay. I'm blonde. Identifying.
[Justin]
It is a part of your identity. Absolutely. So, Lauren and I worked together several years ago.
And maybe just to get us started as a fun way to warm up. In the book, and I think even in the first episode of our podcast, I told my favorite story about belonging was when I brought my team together in Chicago for a dinner. And then we went to a concert.
And Lauren was at said dinner. And so, I'm the only one who's been telling the story from, you know, kind of all the way along. And because it's been a big part of this work, Lauren, what was your experience with that dinner?
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah. I've got behind the scenes information for everyone. You know, about this dinner.
So, people are about to get the real, no. I remember it sort of exactly how you told it. I mean, obviously I was a participant.
And I know that you and I spoke about the dinner like recently, actually. And I said to you, I'm the person that keeps kosher in the story. And, you know, every, I've been kosher 17 years.
And all 17 years I've gone to so many dinners and those, you know, dinners and events and things. And always, it's so ingrained in me now. Like, I'll have the other option.
I'll have the modified option. You know, and that's fine. Not everyone, you know, needs to accommodate every single dietary request.
But for you, you know, and even, I think I knew you for at least two years before that dinner. And every time you would, you know, I don't know if it's just your natural curiosity, but you'd always ask questions about it. You'd always want to know like, so what does this mean?
Why can you not mix milk and meat? Why, you know, why do you have to like do this or do that? So I think you, you know, I feel like you're just a generally curious person.
But the dinner definitely evolved into us all feeling, you know, like we belong basically. Exactly sort of like you labeled it. And also it's like a different feeling, right?
You're going to your boss's house. Like you were the director of the group. So, you know, we, we were invited into your space, into your house.
And, you know, we were all like side messaging about it. Like, what's it going to be like? And it was really like, it was really awesome.
I think even to this day and sorry, if anyone listening I've been on a team with since then, like that was one of the best teams, one of the best environments, one of the most authentic I have ever been. And I still speak to everyone on that team. And events like you inviting us into your house, like it's just another level of feeling, you know, that team dynamic.
So I don't even know if that answered the question. The food was delicious. You did not give us food poisoning.
And yeah.
[Justin]
Thank you. So, you know, what's funny. And I think when we talked about it the last time, I, I, sometimes I kind of forget what we served and it was, I know that we had salmon right.
With like a, with pasta and like a tomato sauce. That was the main.
[Lauren Glazin]
And a salad. I remember.
[Justin]
Yeah. Probably a salad with homemade dressing. So I love, I love a homemade dressing.
And then I think we did have cheese, like a cheese entree to start, but it was like, I knew that your rule was like 30 minutes between everything. Right. So, yeah.
[Lauren Glazin]
I mean, typically it's 30 minutes between like dairy and meat. So like fish was okay. And I definitely remember that.
Like we all, you know, we all sat down and I don't think there was like meat. But like, you know, typical.
[Justin]
No, there was not.
[Lauren Glazin]
Has pork and salami and things like that. And, and, you know, there was, there was like none of that there. So I didn't even have to, you know, bypass.
The, the meat on the, on the cheese. But I remember, yeah, we also, we sat on your sofas and you had like a great, I, I don't think you still live there, but we, you have like an amazing view of like the water you were, we were like up high and we were like sat and hung out and drunk wine. And I'm a massive lightweight.
So I was probably wasted by the end of the cheese course, like one glass of wine and I'm, you know, I'm on the floor. So that hasn't changed by the way, Justin, I'm still a lightweight.
[Justin]
That's all right. That's okay.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah.
[Justin]
Good. I love, I love bringing someone into the space of creating belonging of who was a part of that story. So thank you for sharing.
And the curiosity thing, I honestly, I think I have learned the most about the Jewish religion from you than anyone else. So I want to thank you for that.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah. You should label me Rabbi Lauren, you know, on this because that's, I really like, I think your, yeah, your curiosity and, and it's really fun to teach people about it. You know, it's, it's definitely a big part of my identity and, and maybe we'll get into that more, you know, as our time goes on together, but it's, it's a massive part of my identity and, and it's, it's so fulfilling to talk to people that are just genuine, genuinely curious about it.
So thank you for giving me that opportunity.
[Justin]
Thanks. Well, let's get into it then. So looking at the creating belonging model and kind of the different areas of the creating belonging model, as you reflect on different experiences that you've had, different communities that you've been in either work or, you know, with the church or like anything, you know actually, do you call it church?
Oh my gosh.
[Lauren Glazin]
Synagogue.
[Justin]
Synagogue. Oh my gosh.
[Lauren Glazin]
I was just going with it. I wasn't, I wasn't going to correct you. But it's all, it's perfect.
Yeah.
[Justin]
So any experiences that you've had that, that you can think of that come to light of like when you've sat in one particular quadrant.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah. It's such an interesting question. And like I, as I was preparing for this podcast, like really thinking about it and I think I've been, I think I've sat in every quadrant, you know, in all of them.
And I've sat in some more than the others and in different aspects of my life, like in a corporate environment, I've worked for several, I've been in corporate corporate companies for 10, 11 years. And I've also been heavily involved in like creating Jewish experiences and like, you know, different, different sort of Jewish organizations in my, in my personal life. And so each of those buckets brings up, brings me into like different quadrants.
And I would say largely about being like a gay woman. And I would, you know, I would say, so when, when you and I worked together, I think I was a recluse in, in this model, not, not physically, I was out a lot, but in, in, in the belonging, you know, in, in the model here, I was definitely withdrawn from the gay community. And I think I over, I was overbearing potentially in the Jewish community, because those were like, and they still are like two of my strongest identities along with being British and blonde, but I can't forget that one.
And so, and so I was, I was not out. I was in the closet when we first started working together. Although I think I told you like, I think I told you personally very early on that I was not, not entirely straight.
I remember it. You do?
[Justin]
Absolutely. I remember it. I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe it was one, it was probably one of my first trips to New York after you had started working on the team and we went out to the Stonewall Inn and you were like, Oh, by the way, totally remember it.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yup. Yup. And that was massive for me.
I mean, I think, you know, we sort of played it off and it was what it was, but I, that was a crazy thing for me to do. No one in, you know, no one at home knew my parents didn't know. 99% of our colleagues didn't know.
And then there I am like telling my boss, you know, and, and I've done a lot of work on opening up and being, being able to be more vulnerable. You know, those, those are things I've struggled with a lot just in my personal life. But that was now what, like eight years ago, like seven, eight years ago.
That was a long time ago. And yeah, I definitely remember that. So, so when, when you and I worked together, I was definitely more of a recluse.
I wasn't in the community, at least not out, you know, I was secretly in the community and, and obviously having a great time, but it's very, it's a, it's a completely different, it's a completely different feeling when you are out in the community and, and out loud and proud, which I'm so fortunate to be now, but yeah, I wasn't then. And so that it swings with your identities, right? It's making me question, like if you're in one, one part of this model, where are your other identities?
Cause they don't all sit in the same quadrant at the same time.
[Justin]
Yeah. Yeah. You know, you're making me, me think a little bit about this because I like a lot of, of the way that I describe it as like, we, we, if we look at one distinct community, so for us, it would have been the company that we worked in at that point in time.
And so in that one community, we can, can be in one of the quadrants and we can shift around in those quadrants. But what's interesting is yeah. When, when I met you in 2015, I think you were very, and I wouldn't call you overbearing, but very out with your you were authentically Jewish.
Like you, that was like a large part of your identity and you want people to know that. And I really appreciate and respect that. And then you were also minimizing and hiding another part of your identity.
And so it's interesting because it makes me wonder, like when we have an identity that we can be out and proud about, which was your religion, but another identity that we're like hiding and masking, like what's the, like, where does that put us? It's interesting. So, and you, you're just saying that you felt like you were actually in recluse.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah, definitely with my gay identity for sure. Yeah.
[Justin]
Yeah.
[Lauren Glazin]
And, and I think, yeah, I think it really is interesting because for me being Jewish, being like out and loud about being Jewish is like low stakes. And I don't know if that like translates or like makes sense, but being gay was like much more emotional, much more like deeply rooted in some shame and some other things going on inside me. And so it was definitely easier to be, to be, to be that.
And that's like, you know, some of the personal work that I talk about. So there's a lot of psychology I think that goes into this model as well and how we, and how we talk about our identities and, and how we just are able to be authentic and belong. It's a lot to do with us and the environment, you know, there's lots of factors.
[Justin]
Yeah. Yeah. It's so, so I guess where I'm still like thinking about, so like it was really at that point because you were hiding that one part of your identity, like, it's really hard for you to be in a place of belonging because you're, you're masking hiding part of it.
So it's an interesting one because you're kind of like floating in like the kind of, you know, around the minimizing overbearing recluse like floating in there, but definitely not in belonging because your different identities are, are in different places. I, I'm also curious, kind of given some of the narrative around anti-Semitism and the rise of anti-Semitism, when you say being a kind of, I guess maybe, I don't know if this sounds weird, like out as a Jewish person, like I'm curious how that, you know, and obviously you live in New York right now. So like it's, that's very different than being Jewish and I don't know, Missouri, I would assume.
But I'm curious kind of your experience or thoughts around that.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for asking that.
It's, it's really important conversation at the moment. And let me give you some background. So I, I grew up in London, and being Jewish in Europe is not something that you're out and proud about.
You know, it's, it's really, anti-Semitism has always been high in Europe for obvious reasons, right? World War II and just some other things very close to Israel, which is, you know, a topic that, that has lots of nuances as well. And, and in America, Jewish identity has always been like, this is how, this is my personal opinion, how I feel about it.
Jewish identity in America, especially again, I'm in a bubble in New York, I think, and it's almost seen as like, overly accepted, like a privilege to be Jewish. And I cannot tell you the difference of, of like of mindset that it is to be Jewish in Europe. So I go to synagogue on the holidays, there's no signage anywhere.
There's armed guards around every synagogue. I mean, this, you know, this is the last 34 years that I've been going. There's iron gates.
Every single synagogue has massive iron gates. There is again, no signage. There's, there's police everywhere.
And that's for our safety and security in, in Europe being Jewish. And then I moved to America 10 years ago, 10 years ago now. And I remember my first like three months in America, I went to an event by Jewish Federation in the, I was living in Pittsburgh at the time, great place shout out to Pittsburgh.
And with the, with the Jewish Federation of Pittsburgh, I got taken to a conference in Dallas. So we're in Texas, we're in Dallas. I'm on a coach with, you know, all these other Jewish people, we're going to this conference and we pull up and I look out the window and on the, and on the front of the building, massive, I mean like 70 foot letters, like welcome the Jewish Federation of Pittsburgh.
Like, we're so happy to have you like in massive letters, it said, well, like Jewish and I'm walking into a building, no security anywhere, no nothing. And we're talking about, we're telling everyone the Jews are inside this building. And I said to, I turned to my friend and I said, this is like, how are we going in there?
Like what? It was literally unheard of for me to like, be able to go into a building that promotes being Jewish in America and feel safe. And it was like the best night ever.
Of course it was completely safe. I just, it was just very, very different. So that's just like some of the nuances, even in my identities of being British and Jewish and living both places and having, you know, identities like whirling around everywhere there.
[Justin]
So I didn't, I didn't realize. I didn't realize. And so even in London, that was your experience.
[Lauren Glazin]
Oh yeah. Yeah. And you know me, like, yeah, yeah.
I'm obnoxious. I'm loud. I'm annoying, especially like, especially, you know, earlier Lauren and I, younger Lauren, and I would wear massive, you know, star of Davids.
I had Israel stickers on my car and people, you know, my parents would be like, Lauren, just be careful. Like you, you can't park your car in London with these, you know, like just, you know, we're a little worried here and I'm like, I don't care. Like whatever.
And now I'm like, I get it. Like, you know, I really, I really get it. So yeah, even in London, definitely it was scary.
And so how it feels to me is like, America's catching up with the first 24 years of my life, how I had to be, you know, being Jewish. So.
[Justin]
Wait, but catching up like in a.
[Lauren Glazin]
In like a bath?
[Justin]
Yeah. Okay.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah. Yeah.
[Justin]
I'm like in a regressive way. Right.
[Lauren Glazin]
In a regressive way where Jews are feeling unsafe, where we are, you know, the attacks are on the rise by, you know, I don't remember the percentage by hundreds of percentage. And people are just becoming more disengaged. Yeah.
[Justin]
So I know that you're very involved. You know, across. You know, within your synagogue and kind of across the country and different organizations.
So. I'm curious how you see others. Shifting how they show up.
In the world.
[Lauren Glazin]
You mean Jewishly.
[Justin]
Yeah. Jewishly. Is that a word Jewishly?
[Lauren Glazin]
It is now.
[Justin]
I love it.
[Lauren Glazin]
I love it. I see people shifting a lot and I see people. Scared.
I also think generationally it's different millennials. Boomers Gen Z, you know, there's lots of studies done. And in 50 years from now, what's it going to look like?
And I see people showing up. In ways where they are still being Jewish, but in, in, in sort of a less loud way. So we will meet up for holidays, but in someone's house or, you know, like in a synagogue and even synagogues, you know, in Brooklyn where I live.
There's not that many. Younger people going to synagogue anymore. And we're still really proud.
We're still, I would, I would say culturally very Jewish, but religiously. That that dial is being turned down. In my experience.
And like you said, I've been involved in lots of different Jewish organizations. One of which is. It's called Moishe house.
And. I know, you know, well, I was very. When you and I worked together.
And, and Moishe house, you know, creates Jewish. Jewish experiences for people. Where they're at, like, you know, really sort of wants to promote.
Whatever it means for you to be Jewish. That's what you should do. So I would put on different types of events, some Jewish, some not Jewish.
But, you know, we would all be, we would all be there. We'd be hanging out. And that would be, that would feel Jewish in some ways, but there was.
Oftentimes not much religious affiliation there. And I think that's something that the. The us Jews do do pretty well.
We were just like, we love community. Community is the biggest part of being Jewish. Socializing food, drinking.
I was explaining what being Jewish meant to some of my friends the other day. And I'm like, basically we get really drunk. We eat.
We eat a lot of food. There's one holiday in particular. It's called Purim.
And you are commanded to get drunk. And to be in a different frame of mind than you are when you're sober. So you can access different thoughts and you can connect in different ways.
So. I just, we really, we lean hard into those parts of Judaism in my world. And what I can see.
We just make.
[Justin]
Your description of your experience. As I've always been like, maybe, maybe I can get into this. Like, maybe I should.
I should. Cause like, I don't know. Can I become Jewish?
[Lauren Glazin]
Absolutely. You can. Yeah.
We never, we don't go and recruit. People.
[Justin]
Right.
[Lauren Glazin]
You know, different to some other religions, but. We totally accept it. We could do with a few more.
We could do with a few more Jews. So. Yeah.
[Justin]
I mean, I, I, the, the way that you describe your experience, I just, like I I've always appreciated it. And it's different to what I assumed or expected, but I think the. One of the things that I love, you know, aside from the partying aspect that you've described.
Things that I love is just the, the idea of community and the strength of. You know, bringing people together and. You know, even, you know, like Shabbat on Friday, like, you know, just shutting everything down.
And enjoying time with loved ones. That I love that. I think that's incredible.
And I think we could all like, we don't need to be Jewish, but I think we need to embrace that. That principle of, you know, tuning, tuning to the ones that mean the most to us, not tuning to our phones. I want to hear, I want to hear.
So. You know, the, you talked about the biggest parts of your identity being Jewish, being gay and being blonde. So I I'm, I'm curious, you know, and I think that there's, I'm assuming there's a lot of.
Variations of Judaism, right. Just as there is a lot of variations of an interpretations of Christianity. So I'm curious in your experience, as you.
Came out with your sexual identity. How that. Worked in with your religion.
And even in particular, thinking about the creating belonging model. What quadrant did you, what, you know, what experiences you go through in the quadrants within your own synagogue?
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah. Yeah. That's a great question.
And also just one point on Shabbat. Thank you for bringing that up. It is.
The best 25 hours of the week for sure. And it's funny. I was, I was actually reading, I was reading something about it just quickly.
And, and it said, it was like a conversation between two people and someone said, how on earth. Am I going to be able to not be on my phone, not be on my computer, not be on my Kindle, not be because it, for the Sabbath, for the, for Shabbat, we turn all electricity off. And, and I think it was a rabbi that answered and he said, This is the time that we need the most.
The more technology we have in our lives, the more we should be disconnecting from it just for a period of time. And I, I couldn't agree more. I know.
I go to the sauna a lot. Actually, this is not in my Jewish identity. And I always try and leave my phone outside the sauna because I'm like, I'm forcing myself for these 30 minutes to be without my phone.
And even the 30 minutes I'm like rushing back to my phone, you know, like we all are. But, and so for 25 hours, it seems like such so many hours and it is so necessary. So, so necessary in this day and age, especially mental health.
And, you know, so it all, I think, I think we were onto something 2000 years ago when we came up with this rule.
[Justin]
Yeah. I, so I literally this morning, I just finished the book Stolen Focus. And it is written by a fellow Londoner, Lauren.
But it is fascinating how technology and not even just technology, but just our way of life is destroying our focus, our ability to focus. And so that idea of being able to unplug for a bit and reset is so important. So yes, this is a good side shoot.
So go turn off your technology after, after you're done listening to this podcast.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yep.
[Justin]
Turn off your technology.
[Lauren Glazin]
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Listen all the way through before you turn off your phone.
[Justin]
Yes.
[Lauren Glazin]
But yeah, to answer your question from before, you know, how, how is my Jewish identity, my gay identity and, and, and how, how did it intertwine when coming out?
[Justin]
Hey, Justin here. When I started the Creating Belonging podcast, I set out to create one that I would listen to. And that means episodes shorter than 30 minutes.
So far we've been hitting the mark, but I was enjoying my conversation with Lauren so much that I'm splitting this episode into two parts. We'll be releasing a special second part to this episode in one week. So check back next week to learn how Lauren reconciled her Jewish and gay identities.
Okay.